Church of the Redeemer, Bloor St. was the venue for a fascinating conversation on Nov. 6 between Raja Khouri, a Palestinian, and Dr. Jeffrey Wilkinson, a Jew. At the invitation of the Bishop’s Committee on Interfaith Ministry, the two men shared insights from their 17-year friendship and from their co-authored book, The Wall Between: What Jews and Palestinians Don’t Want to Know About Each Other.
Mr. Khouri is a human rights and inclusion consultant, founding president of the Canadian Arab Institute and co-founder of the Canadian Arab-Jewish Leadership Dialogue Group, among other pursuits. His work brought him in contact with Jewish colleagues, whose shared interest in human rights helped them find common ground. He decided to start talking to Zionists – people who subscribe to a political ideology that advocates for a Jewish homeland in Israel – to learn from people with whom he disagrees.
“I became determined to continue the learning process, and to do that I continue to talk to Zionists. Seventeen years later, it hasn’t stopped,” he said.
Mr. Wilkinson, an American Jew who lives in Guelph, works actively in the Jewish community and beyond on issues related to trauma and the Israel-Palestine struggle. His path to the conversation came through his doctoral studies in education and a deep desire to learn.
“The most important question that I think anyone can ever ask is, ‘What don’t I know?’ That is the moment of propelling yourself into a space that is both foreign and delicious and welcoming,” he told the audience.
Histories rooted in trauma
As the conversation unfolded, the authors emphasized the similarities between Jews and Palestinians.
“Jews and Arabs lived side by side for centuries in the Middle East and Palestine. Both Jews and Arabs are Semites. There’s a lot of commonality in the language, in the way of life, in what’s important,” said Mr. Khouri.
Despite those similarities, Jewish and Palestinian communities rarely interact, even among the diaspora in countries like Canada.
“We don’t talk to each other, we don’t learn from each other, in many ways even like or trust each other,” said Mr. Wilkinson.
The two communities also both have recent experiences of trauma that offer crucial insights into the conflict between them. But there is a stark disparity in the Western world’s awareness of each community’s story, they said. A show of hands by audience members revealed that only one person had known about the Nakba (“catastrophe” in Arabic) before reading The Wall Between, while every person in the room had heard of the Holocaust.
“One of our key jobs is to talk in thoughtful, open ways about the two stories, and maybe even more particularly about the story you know less,” said Mr. Wilkinson.
The Nakba, they explained, refers to the mass displacement of Palestinians during the creation of the state of Israel in 1948. From 1947-49, 750,000 Palestinians were expelled from their homes and sent off as refugees to Arab countries that didn’t welcome them. They have never been allowed to return. Some 400-500 Arab villages were destroyed permanently to prevent Palestinians from returning. Since then, Palestinians have been scattered all over the world, while those who remain in the Holy Land are confined to small areas, often under Israeli control.
“For Palestinians, the Nakba continues today. It is reminded of in every daily experience of oppression, loss of land, loss of housing, loss of freedom, killing,” said Mr. Wilkinson. “If you understand the Jewish experience, very similar to our very long history of nomadic displacement.”
Mr. Khouri stated plainly that he fully accepts the right of the Jewish people to live in a home where they can feel safe, both physically and culturally. “The problem is that they chose my bedroom, and I still can’t go back to it. The other problem is that they blamed me, that I did not accept that they chose my bedroom,” he said.
The authors were clear not to draw direct comparisons between the events of the Holocaust and the Nakba, but they underscored the long-lasting effects felt by both communities. That history of trauma, they said, is essential to understanding the reactions to the events of Oct. 7, 2023, and its aftermath.
As a Palestinian, Mr. Khouri recognized that the reaction of Jewish communities to Oct. 7 was rooted in their traumatic past.
“I realized that to Jews, these weren’t 1,200 Israelis that were killed; these were 1,200 Jews. It’s another attack on Jews. Trauma kicks in,” he said. “The feeling of the Holocaust comes back.”
The resulting war has been likewise re-traumatizing for Palestinians in the diaspora, as they witness the people of Gaza driven from one unsafe place to another.
“These images that we see in colour on our phones these days remind me of grainy black-and-white photographs of the Nakba,” said Mr. Khouri.
Anti-Semitism weaponized
The discussion shifted to consider the complexities of anti-Semitism and the tension between condemning hatred and fostering honest critique of oppression. Rising anti-Semitism hurts both Jews and Palestinians, the authors explained.
For Jews, anti-Semitism is a permanent threat. “It is the past relived in the present, promised in the future,” said Mr. Wilkinson.
While critical of Israel’s actions, Mr. Khouri was unequivocal in his condemnation of anti-Semitism. “I take a very strong stand against anti-Semitism. Jew-hatred is utterly unacceptable to me,” he said.
He also cautioned against the historical pattern of using anti-Semitism to silence and discredit the Palestinian narrative. In the past 20 years, the argument that anti-Zionism is the same as anti-Semitism has repeatedly surfaced. This, said Mr. Khouri, is political stance that serves only to confuse the issue and hurt the fight against true anti-Semitism.
“Zionism is a country with a government with nuclear weapons, with one of the most advanced armies in the world, supported by the United States, oppressing another people,” he said. “As a Palestinian, clearly I cannot be for Zionism the way it has manifested itself.”
For his part, Mr. Wilkinson bristled against the idea of calling every criticism of the state of Israel anti-Semitic. “That’s demeaning to me as a Jew. That’s saying that I am such a victim that you can’t talk about a country that I might have political feelings about without targeting my identity,” he said.
Truth & reconciliation
Inevitably, the conversation turned to what the future might hold for Jews and Palestinians, and the deeper foundations necessary for a lasting peace in the region. Mr. Khouri and Mr. Wilkinson suggested that what is ultimately needed is not simply a peace deal with requirements in place for a two-state solution. That kind of solution, they said, can never be possible without a commitment to truth and reconciliation that acknowledges the wrongs that have been done.
“It’s willingness and it’s recognition by Israel and the larger Jewish world that we have done harm, and that we need to look into the eyes of our fellow Semites and say we’re sorry,” said Mr. Wilkinson.
The message at the centre of their work is that winning must be an experience fully shared by both Jews and Palestinians.
“I don’t feel the safety and freedom that Israel provides in my heart, because it was done on his back. That’s not freedom,” said Mr. Wilkinson. “What makes me free is the assurance that rights are at the centre of our moral compass. Not my rights or his rights, but our rights.”
Mr. Khouri echoed that longing for real justice. “It’s not a big piece of land, but there’s room for everybody in it once they actually decide to share it equally,” he said.
A Canadian response
In answering questions from audience members, Mr. Khouri and Mr. Wilkinson addressed how Canadians can respond to the conflict between Jews and Palestinians. Despite the Israeli narrative historically dominating the conversation in Western countries, they said, Canadians must strive to see the humanity of both sides equally.
“It took us decades to wake up to what South Africa was doing and take a strong stand against it. I hope it wouldn’t take that long to do the same for Palestine,” said Mr. Khouri.
Their advice to Christians in particular was simple: ask yourself what Jesus would do.
“Who has the power, who’s misusing the power, who needs a leg up, who needs support, who needs help, who needs justice, and follow that lens. Not who’s right, but what’s just,” said Mr. Wilkinson.
They also encouraged the audience not to accept statements that over-simplify the situation or dismiss the actions or concerns of one side.
“If we want to understand, we take a step back and we say, ‘What is behind this statement?’” said Mr. Wilkinson.
And perhaps most importantly, they both urged audience members to dismantle the walls that separate them from those with whom they disagree – just as they did – through dialogue rather than debate.
“Hopefully through understanding each other, you’re able to find some common ground. The most important point in dialogue is trusting that the other person is telling you what they genuinely feel, and not just using propaganda or tropes to prove they’re right and you’re wrong,” said Mr. Khouri.
That common ground has been the foundation of a friendship that’s lasted for 17 years and counting.
“I didn’t enter my deeper relationship with Rajah as a Jew to a Palestinian, but as two men who like hummus and an occasional beverage,” said Mr. Wilkinson. “I think all of us who have dismantled a wall, who’ve deconstructed a wall, can tell stories of being richer and fuller because we did that.”
The full conversation between Mr. Khouri and Mr. Wilkinson is available on the diocese’s YouTube channel and below.
I had a sort of conversion experience